Author Topic: ENGLISH ABROAD (Read 5324 times)

gary · « **on:** May 27, 2006, 10:45:23 am »

Beware folks, there is an outfit called ENGLISH ABROAD or at least that is one of the names they use who offer agency work to teachers O.K. so far so good

.

The odd thing is that the office address is never given to you, the only point of contact is an e mail addy or the following phone numbers NO NAMES READ THE RULES. PHONE NUMBERS ARE OUT OF BOUNDS AS WELL.

They do have as far as I have been able to ascertain a possible office on Wireless road which appear to be a fire escape and or a toilet when I inspected the building !! $:-\$

One of my female friends worked for English Abroad and was not paid the 35000.Baht for a months holiday course work at a Bangkok school. Also I have been told that a number of employees have had to really chase after their wages from these people

.

I have actually tried to contact these people myself, however they would not furnish me with an office address but insisted I made a contact point of my choice to meet with them

.

I think the whole shooting match is a scam in the making, if my memory serves me true the Ansell fellow was involved with "The British School of Bangkok " located on Silom road in days since gone. The managements reputation and salary payment system of the British School School of Bangkok was to be polite somewhat questionable in its regularity and indeed actual implementation too

.

Can anyone out there throw some light on this outfit I ask ?

I realise that the moderators may have to remove names from the posting and indeed if I have crossed the boundry of what is allowable and what is not I respect that action.

However people need protection from crooks, bad enough fighting the Thai system at times but to get Farangs trying and indeed it seems achiving the ultimate rip off is indeed despicable.

We should all,be trying to look after our own in an attempt to foster good relations with our school employers, our fellow foreign teachers and our fellow Thai co-workers too, not wondering if ones fellow staff members are going to get paid or is the school about to be ripped off too, thus driving another nail into our Farang coffins.

MrQ · « **Reply #1 on:** May 27, 2006, 11:31:00 am »

Look

If you know using names are out of bounds why the hell did you do it?

MrQ

sir mouse burgher · « **Reply #2 on:** May 27, 2006, 11:43:39 am »

I contacted english abroad found them lacking.
Mr Q, I have read the rulse about posting and I found them a bit confusing. I think gary was only trying to warn or help people and his motives are good as are his ? manners too

hero · « **Reply #3 on:** May 27, 2006, 11:45:08 am »

Quote from: [b]The Rules[/b]

2. No names of ANY individual. It doesn't matter whether it is good or bad, if you mention a name, the post will be deleted. Schools may be mentioned, but directors, co-teachers and staff should not be named.

Not all that confusing really!

ladyteacher · « **Reply #4 on:** May 27, 2006, 12:56:15 pm »

I contacted these people and thought NO NO NON NO they wouldnt give me an office address so I thought not good people.

luk ling, you said you know the man why wonyt he give an address to anyone then ? Is he a crook ?

What is the true story about this agency ?

Hooded_Claw · « **Reply #5 on:** May 27, 2006, 01:43:03 pm »

Certainly that person named as being involved is/was also with the British School of Bangkok. Also, it's true there were accusations on ajarn.com that staff were either unpaid or had to go through a lot of wrangling to get paid at BSB.

There seems to be quite a lot of innuendo and not much substance to this thread so far, though. For example the suggestion that they wanted to meet at a neutral venue could be down to several reasons, not because they are '

'

Some more substantial, first hand info would be good.

hero · « **Reply #6 on:** May 27, 2006, 03:20:32 pm »

Two more posts containing names deleted - I suggest that the whole thread goes in the bin the next time it happens.

As myself and Mr Q have pointed out the rules are very clear and will be enforced on this issue!

Thanks,

Hero

luk ling · « **Reply #7 on:** May 27, 2006, 07:34:07 pm »

Quote from: ladyteacher on May 27, 2006, 12:56:15 pm

I contacted these people and thought NO NO NON NO they wouldnt give me an office address so I thought not good people.

luk ling, you said you know the man why wonyt he give an address to anyone then ? Is he a crook ?

What is the true story about this agency ?

All I know is: A few people I know work/have worked for them and have had no problems. I've worked for them for the past month and so far no problems (payday around the corner so, who knows). They gave me an office address that I didn't visit, but someone has posted that the office address is phoney (again unsubstantiated). The guy I deal with appears a bit nervous, but that is no eveidence of crookery (could be too many E's and 'phet in his youth for all I know). They are posting a lot of job ads on ajarn.com for schools, so even if they are or were connected to the place round Silom that had/has a bad name it would be silly to lose all those school contracts for the sake of ripping people off for a months salary (unless he does a runner with EVERY teachers pay packet from EVERY school they have a contract with). As posted earlier, I did ask the guy directly if he was connected to the "other" place and he denied it. I won't really know anything more until payday comes. But with that many job ads and school contracts he wouldn't be difficult to find if he rips me off. So I ain't that worried about it.

Hooded_Claw · « **Reply #8 on:** May 28, 2006, 12:23:10 pm »

All that sounds fair enough. I wonder why he's denying he was co manager of BSB, though? It all sounds like a bit of an uneasy situation, and suggests they got a bad rep. from that.

Does anyone know if BSB still exists? Did the teachers grumbles about that place get sorted?

english abroad · « **Reply #9 on:** May 28, 2006, 07:43:47 pm »

To come straight to the point, either Gary or the female friend he mentions are telling lies. We can say, categorically, that no female teacher or any other teacher for that matter has ever worked for english abroad (thailand) and not received, promptly, the salary owing to them.
We, therefore, suggest that both Gary and his female friend make an appointment on either 02 *** 3110 or
07 *** 4404 and come to the office on the 36th floor, All Seasons Place, Wireless Road, Bangkok (there is a toilat on the same floor, but anyone with a modicum of common sense would have gone in to the office) with the aim, once his lies become apparent, of hopefully having him banned from this forum, at least under his present name. We would, therefore, request that one of the moderators contacts us so as to be present at the meeting and to act as an independent witness.
As a footnote to this, english abroad (thailand) would like to make it clear that it does not intend to respond to any other false allegations as it would be both time consuming and playing in to the hands of malicious individuals such as Gary.
We appreciate that teflwatch has an important role to play, however we would appeal to its better sense of judgement and remain vigilant to phony contributions especially with the apparent naivety of some of the contributors to this thread in mind.

**Admin Note: No phone numbers, please! You name PM the poster to get the phone numbers. **

english abroad · « **Reply #10 on:** May 28, 2006, 08:28:50 pm »

Sorry, that's toilet. Just a typing error before you all start getting excited.

Mods-Rockers · « **Reply #11 on:** May 28, 2006, 08:29:53 pm »

Now that seems a fair and amicable solution, I for one would be inclined to agree to the meeting Gary, If your claims are well founded. If you would like such a meeting then please PM myself or one of the other mods to discuss the matter.

admin · « **Reply #12 on:** May 28, 2006, 08:54:23 pm »

It does sound nice. Maybe, you can also tell us why anyone would be saying anything bad about your agency. Have you upset any teachers recently? It would be very strange for someone to troll job ads and just decide to take the time out of their busy day to purposefully attack your agency. Usually people, even crazy people, need a reason to do something like this.

Speaksoftly · « **Reply #13 on:** May 28, 2006, 10:11:29 pm »

I don't think it's in the interests of the Mods of this forum to act as a mediator between schools and teachers, no matter how unofficial. At best, there's no way for us to enforce the truth or the subsequent behavior of any party, and at worst we would expose our identities and ourselves to potential legal embroilments.

I think if Mr. Gary is really interested in pursuing any formal negotiations with EA, he should hire a real legal representative (i.e., a lawyer) who will have the power and the knowledge to protect his interests, and EA should do the same. Perhaps we could hear from both of them about the court case here. Otherwise, I think this is an excellent place for both parties to be heard by ALL the Mods (and members, too).

luk ling · « **Reply #14 on:** May 28, 2006, 10:39:06 pm »

Quote from: admin on May 28, 2006, 08:54:23 pm

Maybe, you can also tell us why anyone would be saying anything bad about your agency. Have you upset any teachers recently?

TiT--there are some very weird people out here, who knows what they will do for a laugh? Maybe they arrived for work out of their face and got sacked, maybe one of the guys at EA shagged their girlfriend, maybe....you get the picture. The office address is clearly stated in the post, no-one else has come forward on here to say they've ripped them off. On the numbers: one poster saying he "knows" someone who they ripped off. I know three people who worked for them last school year and the two I'm still in contact with started again with them this year. Okay, so he denied being connected with BSB, no biggie, so would I. I also think the BSB thing may have been blown out of proportion on ajarn.com. I think it's time to leave them alone and let them get on with their job.

Bangkok Phil · « **Reply #15 on:** May 28, 2006, 11:08:08 pm »

Now does Gary sound like the kind of guy who will be taking that sleek elevator ride up to the 36th floor of All Seasons Tower?
I've had a good think about it..............and I'm going for no.

admin · « **Reply #16 on:** May 29, 2006, 06:25:11 am »

I am interested in why any teacher would be complaining about English Abroad. I am sure with their swanky office on Wireless Rd, they are the best agency in Thailand. I guess Luk Ling is right, Gary has to be crazy. Any teacher who could find anything to complan about has to be crazy.

One thing bothers me though, I am sure the head of English Abroad knows exactly who Gary is and why he is complaining. Why are they so cagey? I don't know, maybe I'm just crazy.

Hooded_Claw · « **Reply #17 on:** May 29, 2006, 02:22:10 pm »

Quote from: english abroad on May 28, 2006, 07:43:47 pm

We appreciate that teflwatch has an important role to play, however we would appeal to its better sense of judgement and remain vigilant to phony contributions especially with the apparent naivety of some of the contributors to this thread in mind.

Hmmm. Seemed to me everyone was viewing gary's thread with suspicion even before your contribution. Did you use to co-manage British School of Bangkok?

Uncle Che · « **Reply #18 on:** May 29, 2006, 07:35:19 pm »

Try not to attack another poster, this is a forum for teachers, not for agency owners who like to attack teachers. Offending posts have been split off and put in the Sour Gripes room.

luk ling · « **Reply #19 on:** May 31, 2006, 06:10:16 pm »

Right then, for those who are still interested. Paid on time (a day early actually), in full, and so has everyone I know who works for them. Looks like a dead thread dread

english abroad · « **Reply #20 on:** June 01, 2006, 12:21:25 pm »

Pay day has come and gone and as always english abroad (thailand) has paid all of its staff promptly. english abroad (thailand) and the readers of this thread, no doubt, would be interested to hear from anyone who is willing to say, truthfully, otherwise.
As we have said before, english abroad (thailand) believes that teflwatch has a vital role to play and, incidentally, we believe they play this role well. However, again, we appeal to them not to spread panic amogst our, and for that matter any other, teachers. Understandably, a few of our new teachers, this being their first pay day on account of it being a new term, were a little anxious after reading teflwach, as all sensible people do. We would like to thank those teachers here for keeping faith in english abroad (thailand) and we would hope in future that teflwatch remains responsible and not add further anxiety to a teacher's already stressful life.

Mods-Rockers · « **Reply #21 on:** June 01, 2006, 06:18:59 pm »

from personal experience AND THIS IS NOT WITH ENGLISH ABROAD but with another agency there are rarely any problems early in the semster, it the last month of a semester/academic years when the doodoo hits the rotating machinery. It has to be said that from my perspective Gary did not accurately state his case which did allow him to be torn apart a little.

To all teachers, whoever you work for let us at TEFLwatch know what happens later ok.

english abroad · « **Reply #22 on:** June 01, 2006, 06:29:07 pm »

On the last day of the last term, please be kind enough to print the first paragraph of our last comment again.

english abroad · « **Reply #23 on:** June 02, 2006, 11:19:00 am »

Come on you lot, let's all try and help english abroad (thailand) put this thread to rest. As we have already stated, english abroad (thailand) has no idea who the person that kicked-off this thread is. One of the more astute contributors asked why would anyone do such a thing. Well let us try to answer that by first of all asking a few of our own questions. Why does a sniper roam the steets of some North American city taking pot shots at people? Why does someone hack in to the computer system of someone else? Now we're no psychologists at english abroad (thailand), we leave that kind of thing to all you clever devils out there, but we'd hazard a guess that it's something to do with the feelig of power, all be it for a fleeting moment of time. A moment when the individual escapes his otherwise miserable little existence.

english abroad · « **Reply #24 on:** June 02, 2006, 11:42:23 am »

Uncle Che. While we accept that it is entirely appropriate that our comments were put in with the sour gripes, we believe it is inaccurate to suggest that english abroad (thailand) is in the habit of attacking teachers. On the contrary, with reference to an earlier contribution made on 6 May, english abroad (thailand) has deliberately held its punches. What ever the motive of that particular contributor and if as he claims english abroad (thailand) approached him with a job offer, then we respect him as a teacher and believe it would be futile to send him away with a flee in his ear as we have with the person that started off the more recent thread.

MrQ · « **Reply #25 on:** June 02, 2006, 12:37:41 pm »

If nobody has anything else to say I think that this should be locked later tonight.

Sadly-confused · « **Reply #26 on:** June 02, 2006, 02:56:47 pm »

Quote from: english abroad on June 02, 2006, 11:19:00 am

Now we're no psychologists at english abroad (thailand), we leave that kind of thing to all you clever devils out there, but we'd hazard a guess that it's something to do with the feelig of power, all be it for a fleeting moment of time. A moment when the individual escapes his otherwise miserable little existence.

Just doing my bit of amateur psychology here, and I may be totally barking up the wrong tree, but surely if someone were trying to get that "feelig (sic) of power, all be it for a fleeting moment of time" then he/she would be hitting one of the bigger names and not some second rate backstreet operation?

luk ling · « **Reply #27 on:** June 02, 2006, 10:02:18 pm »

Just one little thing, and it is little. The number for "Penny" at EA that is given on ajarn.com has never been answered by "Penny" when I've rang it. It has also never been "Penny" when that phone has been used to ring my mobile on numerous occasions. It obviously isn't "Penny's" mobile, so why not give his real name on ajarn.com? Not trying to keep the thread alive, it just occurred to me.

Bangkok Phil · « **Reply #28 on:** June 02, 2006, 11:20:43 pm »

I've spoken to Penny. I think it was about information in a job ad but I've definitely spoken to her.

gary · « **Reply #29 on:** June 03, 2006, 10:08:26 am »

I have been away for a few days thus I haven't had the chance to respond to the replies to my original posting.

Now Mods and Rockers have a splendid idea, I am indeed willing to meet with the managers or whatever of english abroad with say, " Bangkok Phil and Mods and Rockers as the observers so to speak so here are my proposals for the meeting ".

We meet at a neutral venue I will of course bring along my residence permit,my passport with current work permit too. The company registration and our tax I.D. will also be supplied along with all our myriad of official documents as issued by the Thai authorities to enable myself and indeed our company to function in a legal legitimate way.

I do of course expect the same courtesies from english abroad as I am assured by verbal comments that they are indeed a subsiduary of a large company based in the U.K. involved in education services.Therefore I am sure that english abroad are able to supply copies of work permits for their managerial team and indeed all the relevant documentaion to prove their honesty and right to conduct business here in Thailand as their posting keep telling us all.

If and when the matter of the legality of english abroads operation and registration in Thailand is proven to the satisfaction of the two observers I will indeed publish a retraction on all education forums in Thailand and indeed I am willing to post apologies and exonerate english abroad in both of Thailands English language newspapers.

Well do you think that is fair everyone ?

Just remember LEWIS EDUCATION we don't want the contract teachers to lose a months salary and the contracted schools either do we ?

Bangkok Phil · « **Reply #30 on:** June 03, 2006, 10:42:18 am »

All education forums in Thailand. LOL. I like it.

hero · « **Reply #31 on:** June 03, 2006, 10:47:13 am »

And there we were all thinking that the motivation behind your OP was the fact that your female friend got ripped off by this company......

Seems you have a different motivation after all! Do you even have a female friend?

Is there any real point to this thread after all?

herrkutz · « **Reply #32 on:** June 03, 2006, 11:49:16 am »

Seems to me that Gary is interested in protecting people.I got burnt by LEWIS EDUCATION for 55,000baht a few years back

.Can't be too careful in Thailand ${^^$ , truth hurts at times but not as much as being twisted and left about destitute by some scumbag company

.

english abroad · « **Reply #33 on:** June 03, 2006, 01:36:49 pm »

It all sounded so very convincing, if not a touch full of filibuster, that is until his last sentence. We believe that Gary should take up any qualms that he might have with Lewis Education. In the meantime english abroad (thailand) would like to state unambiguously, that there is absolutely no connection between us and Lewis Education. Again we would be very interested to hear from anyone who is willing truthfully to contradict this. If it transpires that Lewis Education are passing themselves off as english abroad (thailand), then be in no doubt we will take the appropriate action.
english abroad (thailand) sympathizes with Gary if indeed he has been cheated by another school. However, we believe he should do the correct groundwork before flinging accusations around. We are willing to drop this matter, but would appreciate it, if Gary can find it in him to retract his initial allegations against english abroad (thailand).

english abroad · « **Reply #34 on:** June 03, 2006, 01:38:53 pm »

Can we please keep to the task in hand rather than chasing after the lovely Ms Penny.

english abroad · « **Reply #35 on:** June 03, 2006, 01:44:09 pm »

english abroad (thailand) would like to state unambiguously, that there is absolutely no connection between us and Lewis Education. We would be keen to hear from anyone that is willing, truthfully, to say otherwise.
If it transpires that Lewis Education are passing themselves off as english abroad (thailand), then be in no doubt we will be taking the appropriate action.

Hooded_Claw · « **Reply #36 on:** June 03, 2006, 02:44:13 pm »

So that's clear then. There's no connection between Lewis Education and English Abroad.

How about a direct answer to the question of whether one of the co-directors of English Abroad used to be a co-director of British School of Bangkok, a school which gathered an unsavoury reputation for late or non payment of salaries.

luk ling · « **Reply #37 on:** June 03, 2006, 04:02:43 pm »

Quote from: Bangkok Phil on June 02, 2006, 11:20:43 pm

I've spoken to Penny. I think it was about information in a job ad but I've definitely spoken to her.

See, I said it was only a little thing. It seems Penny exists after all.

Quote from: hero on June 03, 2006, 10:47:13 am

And there we were all thinking that the motivation behind your OP was the fact that your female friend got ripped off by this company......

Yes, that's what I thought. Gary, i thought your "friend" got ripped off by EA. WTF have work permits, company registration and the like got to do with the price of fish. I think I was right earlier and someone at EA shagged Gary's girlfiend. Gary are you familiar with the drug Haliperidol, 'cos your coming across as one of those "care in the community" cases. Give it up mate.

hero · « **Reply #38 on:** June 03, 2006, 04:59:30 pm »

The earlier post titled "Lewis Education" was moved here by me. There didn't seem much point in having a whole new thread for english abroad to make their announcement in!

It's justr fine in here I believe.....

english abroad · « **Reply #39 on:** June 03, 2006, 07:15:28 pm »

Fair enough. We respect that decision.

english abroad · « **Reply #40 on:** June 03, 2006, 07:33:51 pm »

How about this for a direct answer. No co-director of english abroad (thailand) has ever been a co-director of any other school here in Thailand. As we said in an earlier post if you had bothered to read it, english abroad (thailand) is not prepared to answer any other false allegations for fear of playing in to the hands of any individual out to cause mischief.

english abroad · « **Reply #41 on:** June 03, 2006, 07:45:13 pm »

And there we were thinking Wireless Road was anything but a backstreet.
Thanks for pointing out that the typist dropped the 'n'. We'll deal with the sackings later.

Uncle Che · « **Reply #42 on:** June 03, 2006, 08:26:17 pm »

I am tired of hearing about English Abroad and I am sure others are as well, so let's give this topic a break for a few days.

gary · « **Reply #43 on:** July 05, 2006, 06:35:13 am »

Well having been in foreign parts of late I have not been posting on this board (Hooray you all shout!!) however I am a journalist and I along with two others have been investigating teaching agencies in the Kingdom of Thailand and elsewhere in this neck of the woods, very intersting too I might add.

Well all I shall say is "told you so" ref a locked topic "English Abroad" .

Seems as the foriegn guy an Englishman has departed along with the mythical Penny too, the Thai guy is still answering his phone although screening all his calls.

The office phone is disconnected and there are indeed some very perplexed teachers around wondering if they will recieve the monies that are due to them.

The method of payment as described to me by two employees was indeed "odd". English manager leans over the entry and exit gates at a sky train station and counts out their monies in front of the world passing by, how proffessional !!

Indeed reminds me of watching drug dealers and pimps etc perform their operations around the world. So be careful English abroad has indeed changed its name and the scam is coming folks.

Look soon for a full revalation in the local English language press concerning agencies and their practices and indeed the quality, qualifications and crimality of staff employed as teachers by various agencies, the same criteria indeed applies to the agency owners and staff too.

I presume the above assures us all as to why English Abroad would not meet with us face to face with all their company documents to prove their legality in Thailand as I had propesed.

Alas poor Yorrick I knew him well!!

luk ling · « **Reply #44 on:** July 05, 2006, 01:05:48 pm »

Posted by Gary (on a locked topic)

"Well having been in foreign parts of late I have not been posting on this board (Hooray you all shout!!) however I am a journalist and I along with two others have been investigating teaching agencies in the Kingdom of Thailand and elsewhere in this neck of the woods, very intersting too I might add.

Well all I shall say is "told you so" ref a locked topic "English Abroad" .

Seems as the foriegn guy an Englishman has departed along with the mythical Penny too, the Thai guy is still answering his phone although screening all his calls.

The office phone is disconnected and there are indeed some very perplexed teachers around wondering if they will recieve the monies that are due to them.

The method of payment as described to me by two employees was indeed "odd". English manager leans over the entry and exit gates at a sky train station and counts out their monies in front of the world passing by, how proffessional !!

Indeed reminds me of watching drug dealers and pimps etc perform their operations around the world. So be careful English abroad has indeed changed its name and the scam is coming folks.

Look soon for a full revalation in the local English language press concerning agencies and their practices and indeed the quality, qualifications and crimality of staff employed as teachers by various agencies, the same criteria indeed applies to the agency owners and staff too.

I presume the above assures us all as to why English Abroad would not meet with us face to face with all their company documents to prove their legality in Thailand as I had propesed.

Alas poor Yorrick I knew him well!!" End gary's quote

Okay, I was informed by the "Englishman" that he was returning to the UK for a few weeks (who knows, maybe Penny is his gf/wife and has gone with him). He informed me of this well before he was due to leave. He informed me that the Thai guy you speak of would be handling the salary for this month. Payday came, we all got paid, in full. Gary, who are these "perplexed" teachers you speak of? Are they the same people you "know" who didn't get paid and made you start posting on this topic. As for them meeting you with company registration etc. I seem to remember they offered to meet you, with your mythical, unpaid friends to sort out any issues. You then changed to say you wanted them to prove their legality in Thailand, why the change?
The timing of the "rip off" was all to cock. He went before pay day and before the day the school was due to give the agency their cheque, he informed staff that he would be back mid-July. So, if he didn't take the money for June with him, and I go to the school and tell them he hasn't arrived (assuming he doesn't by the end of July) and tell them what's happened and they pay us direct, what has he got. Not a very good rip off is it Gary? As for the "paying at the BTS". I know the guy that happened to. He called to say he was going to pick his salary uo at the office, the guy from EA, coincidentally was going the other way on the same line (to the school). They jumped off the BTS anat the same station and the money was handed over, seems clear enough to me.
So, your a journalist writing about tefler's and such in Thailand, fudge me your original. You'll be writing a piece about bargirls next.

hero · « **Reply #45 on:** July 05, 2006, 03:34:53 pm »

For the record, Gary didn't/couldn't post on a locked topic - he started a new thread and I merged it here because I thought that was appropriate.

Not sure about luk ling - I guess the same thing happened!

hero · « **Reply #46 on:** July 06, 2006, 12:12:37 pm »

OK - I'm unlocking this thread to give posters a chance to discuss what appears to be new information. I don't see any reason for it to remain locked anyway, as long as the postings are sensible and on-topic

hero · « **Reply #47 on:** July 06, 2006, 01:47:20 pm »

Two posts deleted.

Please keep on topic and refrain from slagging off other posters or we'll be locked up again!

hero · « **Reply #48 on:** July 06, 2006, 10:26:03 pm »

Locked again - that was rubbish!

Bangkok Hound · « **Reply #49 on:** October 07, 2006, 11:10:52 am »

My experience with English Abroad (thailand): They pay on time. But don't expect a work permit even after the three month probationary period. One teacher at my school wasn't even provided with the paperwork to get a visa (he has been doing 30 day runs.) As was stated earlier, @#!&% the British bloke supposedly in charge, went home in June I think and apparently has never returned. So if you have issues that need resolved you have to deal with a Thai. It's sad really, my school is rather good. My advice: find out what school EA wants you to work at and then deal directly with the school.

Bangkok Phil · « **Reply #50 on:** October 07, 2006, 07:03:13 pm »

Quote from: Bangkok Hound on October 07, 2006, 11:10:52 am

As was stated earlier, @#!&% the British bloke supposedly in charge, went home in June I think and apparently has never returned. So if you have issues that need resolved you have to deal with a Thai.

Ah, that explains why I suddenly lost contact with them and they stopped answering my e-mails.

english abroad · « **Reply #51 on:** October 07, 2006, 11:07:22 pm »

Indeed, there are a few cases in which it has not yet been possible to issue a work permit. english abroad (thailand) appreciates that this is far from an ideal situation and apologizes to any teacher that is presently in this situation. We will shortly be contacting the few teachers that are without a work permit and explaining to them how we plan to resolve this anomaly. We would also like to make a further apology to Bangkok Hound for finding english abroad (thailand) unapproachable and for feeling it necessary to air his grievence on this forum and not with us directly.

Mods-Rockers · « **Reply #52 on:** October 07, 2006, 11:25:38 pm »

There are no cases where it would be difficult to obtain WP's as long as all contracts, i.e. between employer and school as well as between employer and employee are valid legal documents, providing of course that the employee satisfies the requirements of the MOL and the MOE. of course one reason that the MOE might not issue a TL or the MOL issue a WP is because the employee did not have the relevent paperwork, but then one has to ask oneself why a 'reputable' firm like english abroad would be employing such a person unless they were desperate.

hero · « **Reply #53 on:** October 08, 2006, 01:05:24 am »

Well, if a WP was promised, then a WP should be sought IMO!

If a WP can't be sought, then it shouldn't have been promised!

It appears there has been a "misunderstanding" - I trust English Abroad (Thailand) or one of their employees will keep us posted as to how this goes.....

gary · « **Reply #54 on:** October 09, 2006, 03:45:42 pm »

Told you so, honesty was indeed a rare commodity at english abroad, ::)however the sarcasm is remarkable and I would say they have more front than Blackpool

.

How is an organisation that is contracting staff to schools able to legally obtain a work permit I ask $:-\$ ?

Is it possible we can detect the odour of male bovine decaying fecal matter

?

Why did @%*(&^ not return from the U.K. one asks if the organisation was such a legitimate legal cash cow

?

Bangkok Hound · « **Reply #55 on:** October 09, 2006, 03:50:06 pm »

Quote from: english abroad on October 07, 2006, 11:07:22 pm

We will shortly be contacting the few teachers that are without a work permit and explaining to them how we plan to resolve this anomaly.

Few? None of the teachers at my school who work for your agency have work permits. I won't hold my breath waiting for your explanation.

Quote

We would also like to make a further apology to Bangkok Hound for finding english abroad (thailand) unapproachable and for feeling it necessary to air his grievence on this forum and not with us directly.

Unapproachable isn't the word. Hard to reach is a better description. In fact I contacted the agency about the situation as did other teachers at my school. We're still waiting for a response. Who will pay for these late work permits by the way? The agency, as I was told, or the teachers?

Pibthong · « **Reply #56 on:** October 09, 2006, 09:02:44 pm »

English Abroad,
I hope you are learning the important lessons being presented by your teachers/former teachers, that you are serious and sincere in what you say, and that you shall do business differently in the future. It is unfortunate that your teachers knew they had to come to this site to get your attention. That is not the fault of the teachers, is it? What could lead us to believe you will do things in the future correctly and properly?

I'd know that best when the same teachers who post presently can post again that all is well with them and at English Abroad, that perhaps you've decided to conduct your business on the up and up. Such a development would be commendable, indeed...

hero · « **Reply #57 on:** October 09, 2006, 09:45:25 pm »

Amen to that

Bangkok Hound · « **Reply #58 on:** October 31, 2006, 01:36:15 pm »

English Abroad dutifully paid its teachers today, but no mention of the work permit situation. I give up. I like my school and my students so I'll finish the year with them and then I'm gone. Lesson learned: don't work for agencies.

no homework today · « **Reply #59 on:** November 01, 2006, 10:33:09 am »

Hi all this is my first post here. I have been with EA from about April of 2005 and never had any problems. They were always cordial and fair with me. However things started to slowly fall apart when the British person who was my only contact headed off to the UK on extended schooling. Without putting anyone down I just want to express a situation that customer service with Thais is not yet up to the standards of the UK or other western countries.

Well let me start by saying I had to take a run for 3 weeks in October to the states and when I came back I was informed that my job was no longer there. That was Monday Oct. 30. Unfortunately the issue did not end there. I asked for my pay and they <Thai> said the school did not provide it. Knowing Thai law I told him that was not my problem and I expected to get paid my severance. He asked me to call his boss in the UK and proved me the number. I said I should not need to call him and that I would give him a few days to sort things out. I was being polite but not taking anything short of what I was due. The conversation ended with him chuckling and hanging up in my ear. Giving hopes that he would contact his boss in the UK and get things set straight, I attempted to contact him the next day Tuesday Oct. 31. I was experiencing difficulties in getting him or anyone. I finally broke down and called the UK around 9 pm and talked to the person who has been my contact. He agreed with me that I was due the pay and would contact the office to see what he could do to secure it. I was disheartened that the <Thai> in the office did not even attempt to contact him. It was a sure sign that at least for the moment EA was/is deteriorating into a Thai style agency without someone from the UK in the office.

As this is ongoing at this point I cant say if this will end as a positive or negative story on EA. I will however provide information until this has been resolved.

In closing EA has been very good to me with excluding this one issue. They have even gone out of their way to bring my pay to me near my home during March when the schools are mostly vacant. For the moment take this post on face value as it is just an objective statement of facts.

Bangkok Hound · « **Reply #60 on:** November 01, 2006, 11:17:23 am »

no homework today, did they ever help you obtain a work permit or visa?

I hope you get your situation resolved soon.

no homework today · « **Reply #61 on:** November 01, 2006, 02:16:37 pm »

It was not necessary as I had/have the required Thai documents from another source. However I suspect I am one of the few who has them who was working for EA. That surprised me too that they can just place me without hassle, but I don’t think he <Thai> thought to ask and he assumed something else.

I suspect all of this to change with work permits and proper visas when schools start seeing their teachers leave because of the 90/180 tourist visa thing. Agencies in Thailand may be on the endangered species list now. Something has to give. Schools should be in full panic mode come December.

no homework today · « **Reply #62 on:** November 02, 2006, 01:08:42 pm »

Well here is the latest. When I talked to the guy in the UK I figured that the money would for now be coming out of their pocket. So I offered that he only need pay me 15,000 now to cover my rent and immediate expenses and the remainder could wait a week or so.

Today I met with someone and they did provide me with 15,000 pay and offered me another position that I will interview with on Monday.

We talked about the upsetting chuckle and hanging up of the phone. There was a genuine concern that someone at EA has a lot to learn about interpersonal skills. At any rate it looks for now that EA is working to keep their face in spite of one or more persons who should not be let near the phones. More updates to come as they happen.

luk ling · « **Reply #63 on:** November 03, 2006, 11:44:49 pm »

No homework, glad to hear you got at least some money out of them. Still have no replacement for you and we''re covering your classes between us.

no homework today · « **Reply #64 on:** December 05, 2006, 12:23:22 pm »

OK here is the latest. I waited a bit before posting this. In short I did get all my pay, and I also know the money came from EA coffers and not the school. All decisions about disbursing money came from the UK and the Thais here could not make the decisions.

It would seem the school it turning out to be a bit of a sour note. The contracted teacher have to contribute 100 baht a month for the A/C. Even that the school has yet to replace me they still charged me 100 baht after I was gone. I thought is was really absurd but I gave them the money in the hopes it would aid EA in getting the money from the school. I can’t see them getting the shaft, but then again it is no different than many teachers get after they submit their final grades at the end of the second semester. I knew going into this school it would only be a one year contract. I may put a blurb about the school at some point but I want to hear from the remaining teachers at the end of the second semester. The name if the school you ask?

..... and things about money not being paid???...well lets just perhaps some thoughts were exchanged on how to avoid paying what you owe between the school and a recent graduate. That particular graduate now seems to have a problem with owing income tax on a certain Shin transaction of 329.2 Million shares at 37%. Perhaps you know of him, his father is now living in the UK but seems to be circling Thailand looking for a way back in.

So all in all EA is doing its best to be straight and up front with it’s teachers even though working with some schools is a nightmare. In a way I feel bad for them that they need to put up with so much Thai bull.

english abroad · « **Reply #65 on:** December 08, 2006, 03:37:49 am »

Whether it be Bangkok, Madrid, Rome or Singapore, all pecuniary matters are decided in the U.K. The same goes for recruitment.

luk ling · « **Reply #66 on:** December 08, 2006, 05:25:42 pm »

Why would the decision to employ someone, who had been interviewed in Bangkok, be left to someone in the UK who had never met them? Mai Kow Jai

insideleft · « **Reply #67 on:** December 11, 2006, 04:09:12 pm »

I have just been introduced to this website...

I understand the thread was openned a while ago...but for the record...

I was hired, by English Abroad, to work at Kwong Chow School. I lasted there for several months.

I have Master/Bachelor/Celta accreditations...

English Abroad were sometimes vague, not as strong an advocate as i'd like, were in the end, honest and helpful.

The problems seemed to have emanated from the different contracts i had signed with English Abroad and the contract signed between English Abroad and the Kwong Chow School.

There seemed to be vast differences between the two...when the school began making demands contrary to my contract with English Abroad, I refused to comply, referring the school to my contract.

The school's position was that as they had a contract with English Abroad, I was under the same contract...my informing the school that i was only contracted to the document i had seen and agreed too was not greeted too warmly...

For Example:

I was informed that there would be some extracurricular events i would be obliged to attend. I was particular with English Abroad on this issue and was reasurred several times that these events would be infrequent, perhaps several per year. Within my first two months, there were 3 events, 10 hours of unpaid time, with the first event requiring 800 baht of my money for the food.

Teacher meetings were stated to be once per month. Within the first two months there were four such meetings. All anounced with no longer then 48 hours notice, while one could give an apology, too many apologies were stated to be considered as showing a poor attitude. My main complaint here was the short announcement times. I could not understand why a regular two hour administrative meeting could not be arranged one week in advance.

An extra 'optional' class was incorporated daily. This was stated by English Abroad to be worth approximately 300 baht. Upon these classes beginning, I enquired into the pay, as the school was to pay us separately from our salary, which was to be paid by English Abroad during our probation period. On every occassion, perhaps 5 times, during 4-6 weeks of these classes that enquiries were made into the payment for these classes, the head of the English department refused to provide the information...when pressed, this staffperson claimed that the school had yet to clarify the amount. I was eventually paid 80 baht per class, but did not receive this princely amount until 2 weeks after being sacked.

I worked with several other English teachers...I was informed through my colleagues that the school was going to take over paying us...when i attempted to discuss this issue with the school, a change of contract, i was referred to English Abroad. English Abroad were agreeable to continue the original payment system. I continued to seek a meeting with the school regarding their intention to alter 'my' contract with English Abroad and was repeatedly referred back to English Abroad.

I eventually pressured English Abroad to make a meeting with the school to clarify these seemingly ongoing issues. The meeting was set for a Tuesday and English Abroad informed me that they, the school and the English teachers would attend. The meeting went ahead between the school and English Abroad. I was informed, later that day, by English Abroad that the school had terminated my employment the previuos Friday afternoon. Remember, this was the following Tuesday afternoon. When I asked English Abroad when they had been informed of my being sacked, they replied that they were told during Tuesday's meeting. I asked if I would be paid for Monday and Tuesday, as I'd worked until I was told to stop...English Abroad replied that "as far as Kwong Chow School is concerned, your employment was terminated last Friday afternoon and they will not pay you for Monday and Tuesday." English Abroad could not say why the school did not make a statement on the previous Friday.

Eventually, I was paid in full by English Abroad.

I do not know if the school paid English Abroad for my work on the Monday and Tuesday.

I was informed that my employment was terminated on 'personality' grounds. Whilst I cannot say categorically, my belief is, my demands to be treated in accord with my contract put me at immediate odds with the head of the English Program...a fellow Falang...

I cannot say what the truth of my experiences with the Kwong Chow School were. All the above are my view of myexperiences.

I have no actual knowledge of any communications between the school and English Abroad.

My experiences with the school were paradoxical...with the management...my experiences were difficult to state, sometimes warm and friendly, other times dismissive and disrespectful...with my teacher colleagues, my experiences were 'generally' very supportive and welcoming...with the student body, my experiences were entirely wonderful...

I am an inexperienced teacher and so, have little references points...however, the school did appear to me to have good resources to assist my teaching...

was I the problem, was the school, was English Abroad, was the problem the dual contracts...I cannot say...but the experience left me feeling entirely abused and disrespected, in spite of being fully paid...

insideleft...

no homework today · « **Reply #68 on:** December 18, 2006, 11:11:45 pm »

I can understand your post, and allow me so spread some light. EA has just recently decided to get involved with Thai schools (2005) as they were more a business English company. No doubt they got taken a few times because of the newness to the market. I saw that the schools contract with the direct teachers looked a little sweeter in some places, however all and all EA as an agent acts as a buffer between the contracted teacher and the school. If I were direct I am sure I would have been stiffed for the whole months pay with some vague threat of never finding a teaching job again if I contested it (Ask me how I know). Bottom line as I see it Thai agencies will screw you over and charge you to do it. Non Thai agencies will at least try to work to the contact. Welcome to teaching in Thailand!!!!

english abroad · « **Reply #69 on:** February 13, 2007, 10:38:29 pm »

For those still sufficiently interested then it would appear that insideleft's description of events is fairly accurate. However, perhaps english abroad (thailand) should point out that we received no payment from Kwang Chow School for all of insideleft's hard work and that, indeed, his salary was paid entirely by english abroad (thailand). Furthermore, english abroad (thailand) terminated the contract with Kwang Chow School immediately after the dismissal of insideleft. We believe that insideleft was doing a good job at Kwang Chow School and that he was treated very poorly by them. We would like to take this opportunity to wish insideleft the best of luck with his future and to say that we believe he will make a succesful career within tefl.

samvimes · « **Reply #70 on:** February 14, 2007, 06:18:40 am »

Kudos to all parties apart from what looks like an awful awful school.

I would imagine English Aborad will cease doing business with the school in question?

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