Author Topic: EF/English First Thailand  (Read 8519 times)

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Offline Jon

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Re: EF Chiang Mai
« Reply #15 on: March 08, 2006, 03:16:43 PM »
Update:

1. As part of the next process of the legal saga - March 7th the franchisee brother's translation was not accepted by the civil court. The case will be finally heard/investigated November 2007. The case depends on the translation, so very unlikely the defendent (former DoS) needs to worry. The door to compromise has been opened slightly, but the DoS feels that only vindication in the court room will satisfy him.

2. The former DoS has had contact with the EF person responsible for Thailand.


« Last Edit: May 05, 2006, 03:48:58 PM by Jon »

Offline CLAMP

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English First Seacon Square
« Reply #16 on: April 29, 2006, 12:11:38 PM »
Beware this outfit.

Having worked? here for a number of months, things are clearly not what they should be.

Now it is understandable to put up with some crap in whatever workplace that you have the pleasure of landing in, however this place continues to get worse.

Firstly it is the general lack of resources available to the teachers. To actually purchase any relevant materials is like getting blood out of a stone.The use of the photocopier is almost seen as a crime - we are often told that we are using the machine too much. The photocopy police here guard the machine with avengence.

Communication is another problem - lessons are rearranged or changed and teachers find that there lessons have been changed on arrival or even canclled. There is never a reason for it, it just happens. If there are complaints the heavy handed memo's appear.

Regarding sickness, I quote, "it is unprofesional to call in sick". Apparently teachers now have to give 48 hours notice if they are going to be sick. I find this rather strange as no one can predict with any accuracy when he or she will be sick. In respect of this, the teacher who had been sick quite genuinley had phoned at the earliest opportunity, however because the "office staff" don't turn up to 8:30am the margin of being able to report sickness is very minimal. I am sure that parents of children would hardly be impressed with a teacher throwing up all over one of their children.

Work permits are often held - initially we need to take a photocopy and you can have it back. Myseriously these then appear to be locked away in the depths of the centre. Will you ever get to see it again? I can't answear that one yet.

Lesson reports are often censored by the owner - as they may be to negative! In fact one teacher recently was asked to sign a batch of reports that he hadn't written. He quite rightly refused to do this. The following week, the same teacher was then presented with a batch of reports. Now as the "admin staff" are not the brightest he decided to check before giving them out. Sure enough the same reports written, with his name on it and pp'd by the owner. He had already said that he would not have anything to do with the reports as he had only taken the class on 2 occassions before the completion of the course and could not verify what had been written. This was a prime example of the deceit in which this school operates.

There have been other occassions when pay has been late and when pay has been incorrect.

Teachers are blamed for the lack of students, however this no fault of there own. The majority of students continue their courses so numbers stay consistent. It is quite clear that the marketing plan or lack of it is one of the major reasons for limited expansion. English First seem to have a lack of desire to remain in Thailand, and with the closure of their head office in Bangkok and planned closures of some of their outposts it seems quite clear that this is a company in retreat. Having lost their operations manager becasue they treated him like shit the ship appears to be rather rudderless. This particular centre's idea of "target marketing" is to hand out a few leaflets at the BTS or otside Seacon.To me it's just a waste of paper - you only have to witness the amount of leaflets tossed back onto the streets.

The centre again now finds itself without a DOS- all to frequent here as any self respecting teacher will not put up with the continual interference from above. It is interesting to note that this centre now only has one full time teacher. The DOS leaves this week, and 4 more teachers are finishing, which will leave this establishment with only one full time and two part time teachers.

I am sure you get the idea of what I am saying. if you want to work in a diorganised shambles were then come over here.

Offline blackpanther

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Re: English First Seacon Square
« Reply #17 on: April 29, 2006, 02:38:53 PM »
Why's the DOS leaving?

Any specific reasons besides the ones you've listed?
« Last Edit: April 29, 2006, 03:15:43 PM by blackpanther »

Offline hero

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Re: English First Seacon Square
« Reply #18 on: April 29, 2006, 03:13:00 PM »
Quote
English First seem to have a lack of desire to remain in Thailand, and with the closure of their head office in Bangkok and planned closures of some of their outposts it seems quite clear that this is a company in retreat.

Where was the EF "Head Office" in Thailand?  EF are all franchises - they are sold to anyone who wants to use the brand.  They market these franchises in Thailand and many other countries. 

I don't work for EF, but I do know how they operate - the reason that they are in decline in Thailand is purely because they are not competitive.  The franchise rights are very expensive, the indusrty in Thailand is so competitive that EF franchises simply cannot compete on price in the most profitable markets!  I should say that some EF franchises do seem to be able to make a good return though {-}

Please don't think I'm defending them or anything - I don't see that there is anything to defend.  The way EF Seacon Square is run is down to the franchise owner.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2006, 03:14:24 PM by hero »

Offline CLAMP

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Re: English First Seacon Square
« Reply #19 on: April 29, 2006, 04:21:20 PM »
Quote
English First seem to have a lack of desire to remain in Thailand, and with the closure of their head office in Bangkok and planned closures of some of their outposts it seems quite clear that this is a company in retreat.

Where was the EF "Head Office" in Thailand?? EF are all franchises - they are sold to anyone who wants to use the brand.? They market these franchises in Thailand and many other countries.?

I don't work for EF, but I do know how they operate - the reason that they are in decline in Thailand is purely because they are not competitive.? The franchise rights are very expensive, the indusrty in Thailand is so competitive that EF franchises simply cannot compete on price in the most profitable markets!? I should say that some EF franchises do seem to be able to make a good return though {-}

Please don't think I'm defending them or anything - I don't see that there is anything to defend.? The way EF Seacon Square is run is down to the franchise owner.

I can undersatnd what you are trying to say. However, yes EF do have a Coutry head office in Bangkok. They have been on the top floor of Emporium building for some time. I know the Country Operations manager, who has since left the company about two months ago, as basically EF have been screwing oer the franchise holders in a number of ways. No although I have some gripes in respect of SS, the general attitude towards the franchises by EF has been particularly disturbing. They have been cast out to drift by the organisation, and promises that were made by EF to the franchises have not been kept. I think that one  of the reasons that things are going a little off course is that franchises are becoming disenchanted. With the operations manager not being replaced they are now doing most of the management side of things from Indonesia, so I think that suggests that they won't be in Thailand for much longer. Yes I agree that the franchises are not cheap, and on the whole some of the centres are not well located - in respect of competiveness, some more creative thinking in that area would help.

I have to say that although at times the School here is run like a circus - the owner on most occassions is a likeable person - it's just the interfering etc....and the unhelpful admin staff, and the one full time teacher left.

I am sure that the DOS will post in the coming days in respect of his departure. It is a shame that he is going, as those that are remaining will have to put up with the full time plonker (teacher) who will try to assume some degree of importance. More of that another time.

Offline hero

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Re: English First Seacon Square
« Reply #20 on: April 29, 2006, 04:38:50 PM »
Quote
the general attitude towards the franchises by EF has been particularly disturbing. They have been cast out to drift by the organisation, and promises that were made by EF to the franchises have not been kept

Yes, I too have heard this.  It seems to happen a lot in a Thailand, in other industries too.  Thai mentality tells them that if they buy a nice shiny franchise that costs a lot they just have to sit back and count the cash.  Unscrupulous marketeers are very quick to exploit such delusions.  I'm sure EF are no exception!


Offline CLAMP

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Re: English First Seacon Square
« Reply #21 on: April 29, 2006, 06:40:08 PM »
Yes, you are right - there is a degree of miss selling on the part of the Franchise and at times franchise holders believe that the money will just roll on in.

My understanding is that they will close down all of there schools outside of BKK in the coming months, and then reduce the schools in Bangkok. I do actually have some sympathy for the franchise holders as they have been taking some shit from EF. There is a particularly interesting e-mail floating around in the cyber system locked away in an e-mail account, which basically states that the franchise holders can go and get fucked. I think it originated in Indonesia from their main office. But again I can't confirm this.

I think that the general ill will eminating from the top has trickled down and has caused a degree of disenchantment, which in the end always filters down to the teachers.

Offline CLAMP

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Re: English First Seacon Square
« Reply #22 on: April 29, 2006, 06:41:49 PM »
Maybe we could change the thread title to EF in general?

Uncle Che

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Re: EF/English First Thailand
« Reply #23 on: April 30, 2006, 07:55:27 AM »
The topics EF Chiang Mai and EF Seacon Square have been combined to one topic, any EF related posts should go into this thread.

Offline zippy

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Re: Fraud at EF Chiang Mai and its actions against the whistleblower
« Reply #24 on: April 30, 2006, 08:44:26 AM »
Come on EF.

Most EF schools in Thailand, the Thai country director and the farang Academic Operations Manager for Thailand have been informed of this thread so why the silence???

Jon

Jon it will be difficult for the Farang operations manager to reply as he told EF to go fudge themselves. Seems that he wasn't to impressed with some of there unpleasant practices either.

As you probably know the Country manager is now based in Indonesia from my understanding - and they don't really give much of a shit about the franchise's as they are just collecting their money. Don't think they will be to worried about what happens to the centre's as it seems to be their plan to cast them out on their own.

Offline zippy

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Re: EF/English First Thailand
« Reply #25 on: April 30, 2006, 08:49:51 AM »
Thanks to CLAMP -for his general overview. I don't think that this is the worst place to work, just a little disorganised and in particular there is a fairly odious individual that works there who does a significant amount of shit stirring in the centre, which in turn makes it difficult for the DOS and the other teachers.

Yes, I was the one with the dodgy reports to sign, however this has been rectified and I received a sincere apology from the owner. ISo in that respect I won't complain to much.

Offline Johnny Rotten

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Re: English First Seacon Square
« Reply #26 on: May 05, 2006, 10:57:17 AM »
Yes, you are right - there is a degree of miss selling on the part of the Franchise and at times franchise holders believe that the money will just roll on in.

My understanding is that they will close down all of there schools outside of BKK in the coming months, and then reduce the schools in Bangkok. I do actually have some sympathy for the franchise holders as they have been taking some shit from EF. There is a particularly interesting e-mail floating around in the cyber system locked away in an e-mail account, which basically states that the franchise holders can go and get fucked. I think it originated in Indonesia from their main office. But again I can't confirm this.

I think that the general ill will eminating from the top has trickled down and has caused a degree of disenchantment, which in the end always filters down to the teachers.


Do you know which schools outside of BK in particular and what criteria are they using to select the schools to close and why EF are taking this hardline?

There's Hat Yai, Nakhon si Thammarat and Chiang Mai.


I know a few EF teachers and have enough knowledge about franchising in Thailand to know that the franchisee often gets shafted - franchising comes under civil law here and there are no specific laws to protect a franchisee as there would be in the west.


« Last Edit: May 05, 2006, 12:15:52 PM by hero »

Offline hero

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Re: EF/English First Thailand
« Reply #27 on: May 05, 2006, 12:17:32 PM »
I removed a couple of initials (not names) from the above thread in line with the rules.  If you guys want to discuss people by their names, that's fine - just do it in a PM! {-}

Thanks

Offline MrQ

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Re: EF/English First Thailand
« Reply #28 on: May 06, 2006, 07:30:15 AM »
Just to make a point on the WP front.

The WP  belongs to the school, not to the person. So it is quite accebable for the school to keep it.

I know I let my school keep mine. It's not as if you ever have to use it anyway.

correct me if I am wrong somebody

Offline samvimes

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Re: EF/English First Thailand
« Reply #29 on: May 06, 2006, 09:44:01 AM »
Sorry Mr Q, it might be issued to because of the school but it belongs to you. You are supposed to carry it with you and show it on demand, not the school.

You need it to get a mobile phone number contract, register for UBC, open a bank account in some places, get broadband internet installed at home, there are many cases where it is needed.

The teachers's licence has two parts, one the teacher is supposed to have and the other for the school to keep; yet some schools insist on keeping the whole document.

Holding  back documents like work permits and teaching licences (contracts, degrees, passports etc.)  is extremely dubious and I would not trust a school that deemed it necessary to do this as a school that does this tries to maintain a sort of leverage over its employees and is not one that is going to have good working relationships with its staff.


 

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