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Author Topic: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?  (Read 2112 times)

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Offline bcqcboy

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Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« on: February 17, 2006, 03:15:45 pm »
This is just a question I'm asking out of curiousity and perhaps for the distant future. I'm an English teacher at a public Korean high school and I love my job (make 90,000+ Baht a month, he he he) and while I have trouble seeing myself ever leaving this job, it may come to pass that I grow tired of Korea some day. If that happens I was wondering if there are any jobs open to foreigners in the *public* school system in Thailand. I just returned to Korea from a holiday in Thailand and really loved it. With some money saved, I could see myself living there for a while. However, I refuse to work in a corrupt and incompetant private education industry.

So, what I'm wondering is if there are any jobs at schools that are not privately owed or at non-proffit, private high schools that have a sound academic reputation? Has anyone worked at such a place? If so, what was it like?

Offline Johnny Rotten

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2006, 03:51:28 pm »
However, I refuse to work in a corrupt and incompetant private education industry.



won't be seeing you here then?    government and private schools stink with corruption.

Offline Troopie

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2006, 04:26:41 pm »
I've worked in 2 government high schools here & I recommend you check out the postings for Hua Hin School. That is a bad example, agreed, but it isn't outstandingly so.
Oh, & it isn't just the private schools that are corrupt, so be prepared! {j<o>

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2006, 08:10:26 am »
Reading this board does not create a very positive impression. Does anyone have good experiences at Thai middle or high schools to share?

Offline hero

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2006, 02:24:09 pm »
Seriously mate it ain't all bad!  This forum (as was its previous incarnate) is seen primarily as a place to report bad schools and  bad work practices and to let off steam.  Unfortunately, I also think many with positive experiences to share (myself included) are put off because in the past positive threads have come in for a bashing from the hate squad purely because they were positive posts.  So currently it exists as a negative zone!

I think that taking into account the number of teachers working here because they like it here (i.e. loads!) says that it ain't all doom and gloom!

I personally love my job(s) here and wouldn't be anywhere else really (although I may be heard moaning about it too from time to time!)

Offline hero

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2006, 02:26:13 pm »
That said - if you are well eqipped, experienced and qualified I would generally give government schools a wide berth.  Unless you visit the place and check out the people running the program and the teaching conditions etc., there are good ones and nice places to work but they are outweighed by the bad ones IME.

Offline Freddy Farang

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2006, 04:17:02 pm »
Quote
I'm an English teacher at a public Korean high school and I love my job (make 90,000+ Baht a month, he he he)

Yes but what's the cost of living there?!!!! Doesn't matter what you earn it's your disposable income that matters at the end of the day.


(Bubbles from Little Britain)
« Last Edit: March 29, 2006, 12:55:56 pm by admin »

Offline Notanewbie

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2006, 04:06:07 pm »
"I refuse to work in a corrupt and incompetant private education industry"

Quite judgmental aren't we? Especially for someone who has never worked here. Maybe in Korea they love foreigners who feel the need to pass judgement on every aspect of their jobs, but it usually isn't the ticket to success in LOS. Thailand is Thailand, don't like it, please don't come. We already have way too many whining losers who think becasue they have a white face they have to right to constantly bad-mouth the country from sun up to sun down, we don't need another. Sure, everyone lets off steam once and awhile, but if you start off with a superior attitude you will not be happy here and people here will not be happy to work with you. Please stay in Korea where you are making around 25,000 US a year (about the same as the assistant manager of the local McDonalds in Korea I suspect, wow, you really made me jealous of your riches).

Offline MrQ

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2006, 04:48:16 pm »
Keep the personal attacks under control please.

Offline Notanewbie

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2006, 07:43:37 pm »
Sorry,

But the OP bragging about his great salary and then complaining about others who are ?corrupt? was just too hypocritical to let pass. Holier than thou attitudes from those with no clue really gets up my nose. I know I should just ignore it. But what the heck, this is the Internet, if one can?t rally against one?s pet peeves and pretentious hypocrites on the Internet, where can one? Fine, if Thailand is too corrupt for one?s sense of justice, don?t come here. What is so hard about that? But why insult an entire industry in an entire country when one is in another country? Was the OP trying to persuade us of his superior position in life? Does the OP think all teachers in Thailand are such losers as to be impressed by a salary that is barely above minimum wage in our home countries?? I really don?t understand the purpose of the posting. Was it to find out some general information? Was it to impress us with his lofty salary? Was it to insult the entire private education industry in Thailand? Ok, maybe I shouldn?t have tried to knock the OP off his high horse, I will try to place nice with others from now on and hope to get a gold star or two from some of the elementary school teachers looking in.

"private high schools that have a sound academic reputation?"

Ok, I will be helpful. No, there are no good schools here, therefore I suggest you stay in Korea forever.
« Last Edit: March 08, 2006, 07:47:24 pm by Notanewbie »

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #10 on: March 08, 2006, 08:44:55 pm »
Ok, Notanewbie, point taken, but you are pushing it into the really really off-topic department, so I highly suggest that you move it on over to Sour Gripes. Sounds like a perfect thread for Sour Gripes.

Let''s stay on-topic.


Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #11 on: March 29, 2006, 12:34:25 pm »
Sorry,

But the OP bragging about his great salary and then complaining about others who are ?corrupt? was just too hypocritical to let pass. Holier than thou attitudes from those with no clue really gets up my nose. I know I should just ignore it. But what the heck, this is the Internet, if one can?t rally against one?s pet peeves and pretentious hypocrites on the Internet, where can one? Fine, if Thailand is too corrupt for one?s sense of justice, don?t come here. What is so hard about that? But why insult an entire industry in an entire country when one is in another country? Was the OP trying to persuade us of his superior position in life? Does the OP think all teachers in Thailand are such losers as to be impressed by a salary that is barely above minimum wage in our home countries?? I really don?t understand the purpose of the posting. Was it to find out some general information? Was it to impress us with his lofty salary? Was it to insult the entire private education industry in Thailand? Ok, maybe I shouldn?t have tried to knock the OP off his high horse, I will try to place nice with others from now on and hope to get a gold star or two from some of the elementary school teachers looking in.

"private high schools that have a sound academic reputation?"

Ok, I will be helpful. No, there are no good schools here, therefore I suggest you stay in Korea forever.


My remark about 'a corrupt and incompetent private education industry' was directed towards Asia in general but *Korea* in particular, not Thailand. If Thailand's private education sector (for-proffit, private academies - not regular schools) is significantly different it would be nice to hear about it, but from stories I've heard it sounds as bad or worse than Korea's. I was hoping that regular, state-funded middle and high schools may be different, though from the responses on this thread I take it that also may not be the case.

My original reason for posting this was because I visited Thailand (during my paid winter holidays, he he) and really loved the country and the people. If one could get a job as a real teacher in a real school I think it might be a wonderful place to live. Winter in Korea lasts forever and I much prefer too hot to too cold (It's still going down to zero at night here). However, I will not be an English clown making a businessman rich by catering to the whims of unreasonable parents who have no idea how to teach EFL in Korea, so why would I do it in Thailand? If, on the other hand, there are real teaching jobs in Thailand that only involve teaching at the secondary level at a real school, it would be very interesting to hear about them.

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #12 on: March 29, 2006, 12:38:34 pm »
Quote
I'm an English teacher at a public Korean high school and I love my job (make 90,000+ Baht a month, he he he)

Yes but what's the cost of living there?!!!! Doesn't matter what you earn it's your disposable income that matters at the end of the day.


(Bubbles from Little Britain)

I live on residence at my school in a two-bedroom house the school owns and have free cable and Internet off the school's feed. Utility costs in winter are horrible - perhaps 6-8,000 Baht / month. For food, beer, and ciggies the cost is about 50-100% more than Thailand. All in all it's a great place to save money.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2006, 12:55:35 pm by admin »

Offline Notanewbie

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #13 on: March 29, 2006, 01:09:29 pm »
"However, I refuse to work in a corrupt and incompetant private education industry."

"I have trouble seeing myself ever leaving this job, it may come to pass that I grow tired of Korea some day."

"My remark about 'a corrupt and incompetent private education industry' was directed towards Asia in general but *Korea* in particular."

The education system in Korea is corrupt and you refuse to work there, but also can not see yourself ever leaving Korea? Maybe I am missing something here, are you making a distinction between private and public schools in Korea? What does that have to do with teaching in Thailand? Where exactly do you REFUSE to work? You seem to have a fixation about your pay, why then are you so judgmental against other people (school owners) who are interested in making profits?  In econ 101 class we teach people usually go into business, whether in the educational industry or others, to make a profit and the way to make a profit is to provide a service or product people are willing to pay for. Why is that corrupt?

"I will not be an English clown making a businessman rich by catering to the whims of unreasonable parents who have no idea how to teach EFL in Korea, so why would I do it in Thailand?"

I don't understand. Have you thought about teaching in North Korea or Cuba?

Business people in Thailand, Korea, the UK, The USA, or Nigeria all are interested in making a profit. Nothing at all wrong with this.

Is your purpose posting here to try to discredit the free-market economic systems of the world or is it to find out information about teaching in Thailand?

"If Thailand's private education sector (for-proffit, private academies - not regular schools) is significantly different it would be nice to hear about it, but from stories I've heard it sounds as bad or worse than Korea's."

How is it so "bad"

Government schools in Thailand are mostly restricted by law on how much wages they can pay a foreign teacher. In general, private schools pay more, have better facilities and are less corrupt due to having the profit motive which is absent in the public school system. A corrupt school gains a bad reputation which hurts profits.

Public or private, both have advantages and disadvantages.

I strongly recommend you stay in your top dollar perfect environment in your pristine public school in Korea and not come to Thailand and become contaminated by individuals from all walks of life since the entrepreneurial attitude is common here. Normally overly judgmental people do not prosper in Thailand, I am surprised that they do so well in Korea. 

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #14 on: March 30, 2006, 12:40:02 pm »
"The education system in Korea is corrupt and you refuse to work there, but also can not see yourself ever leaving Korea? Maybe I am missing something here, are you making a distinction between private and public schools in Korea?"

Yes, I am. In particular I'm making a distinction between regular middle and high schools, and after-school language academies, the latter of which can be quite pathetic.

"What does that have to do with teaching in Thailand?"

I'm wondering if it's same-same over there.

"Where exactly do you REFUSE to work?"

At a school that is not really interested in students learning but only wants their parents' money.

"You seem to have a fixation about your pay, why then are you so judgmental against other people (school owners) who are interested in making profits?? In econ 101 class we teach people usually go into business, whether in the educational industry or others, to make a profit and the way to make a profit is to provide a service or product people are willing to pay for. Why is that corrupt?"

Because in Korea what happens at a lot of private language academies is nothing short of fraud.

"Business people in Thailand, Korea, the UK, The USA, or Nigeria all are interested in making a profit. Nothing at all wrong with this."

That depends upon how they go about making it.

"Is your purpose posting here to try to discredit the free-market economic systems of the world or is it to find out information about teaching in Thailand?"

I'd be interested in knowing if there are jobs like mine in Thailand, which I may consider doing some day.

""If Thailand's private education sector (for-proffit, private academies - not regular schools) is significantly different it would be nice to hear about it, but from stories I've heard it sounds as bad or worse than Korea's."

How is it so "bad""

Ummm, you've read this very site?

"Government schools in Thailand are mostly restricted by law on how much wages they can pay a foreign teacher. In general, private schools pay more, have better facilities and are less corrupt due to having the profit motive which is absent in the public school system. A corrupt school gains a bad reputation which hurts profits. "

Thanks - that's the sort of thing I was intereseted in.

Offline Notanewbie

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #15 on: March 30, 2006, 03:14:44 pm »
"At a school that is not really interested in students learning but only wants their parents' money."

Fair enough, I wouldn't want to work at that type of school either. However, who decides if the school falls into this category or not? Teachers using subjective judgements or the paying customers in the market? How can a school get the parent's money over an extended period of time and not provide the type of education the customers want? Are Korens that rich that they throw away money on "bad" edcuation? Why do they continue to send their children to these schools if they are nothing but frauds?

If I could summarize, you refuse to work in a "bad" school. Is that about right?

Good and bad can be very subjective terms, and trying to read the motives of others is even more subjective. I have never worked for a business in any industry where making money was not the primary goal, and I have never worked in an industry where long-term success was not dependent on satisfying the customer. I don't see wanting to make money and being interested in the student's learning to be mutally exclusive, in fact, i don't see how one could stay in the educational business, or any business for that matter, for long without providing value for money.

Owners of schools are not the enemy of teachers. These owners  take the risks and invest their money while creating employment for teachers. The more employment options we have the better.

School owners and teacher often have differing objectives leading to conflict, but without them, our employment options would be much less than they currently are.

You can refuse to work anywhere, your choice, but it sounds like you have very subjective criteria in which to evaluate schools, and I can't really figure out what you want. A school that pays teachers a lot of money but aren't interested in their own profits? Slim pickings anywhere I would suspect.

If individuals with motives of making money and improving their lives is offensive to you, I don't think you would fit into life in Thailand. Owning a business is the goal of 80 to 90% of all of the students I have ever taught here.

Enjoy your big money job in Korea where no one is allowed to want to make money except yourself.

Cheers

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #16 on: March 30, 2006, 06:41:13 pm »
"At a school that is not really interested in students learning but only wants their parents' money."

Fair enough, I wouldn't want to work at that type of school either. However, who decides if the school falls into this category or not? Teachers using subjective judgements or the paying customers in the market? How can a school get the parent's money over an extended period of time and not provide the type of education the customers want? Are Korens that rich that they throw away money on "bad" edcuation? Why do they continue to send their children to these schools if they are nothing but frauds?

Well if they are anything like the majority of Thai parents their only concern is what is written on the end of year reports, as long as little Somchai gets his 3.5+ GPA and the school says his English is good the parents are happy. The mere fact that Somchai cant even tell you how old he is in English, add 2 plus 2 and get a repeatable answer somewhare betwen +/- infinity and has no idea where in america the country of greece isdoes not matter, its pure smoke and mirrors and the god GPA is all that matters!

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #17 on: March 31, 2006, 12:07:15 pm »
"At a school that is not really interested in students learning but only wants their parents' money."

Fair enough, I wouldn't want to work at that type of school either. However, who decides if the school falls into this category or not? Teachers using subjective judgements or the paying customers in the market? How can a school get the parent's money over an extended period of time and not provide the type of education the customers want? Are Korens that rich that they throw away money on "bad" edcuation? Why do they continue to send their children to these schools if they are nothing but frauds?

Well if they are anything like the majority of Thai parents their only concern is what is written on the end of year reports, as long as little Somchai gets his 3.5+ GPA and the school says his English is good the parents are happy. The mere fact that Somchai cant even tell you how old he is in English, add 2 plus 2 and get a repeatable answer somewhare betwen +/- infinity and has no idea where in america the country of greece isdoes not matter, its pure smoke and mirrors and the god GPA is all that matters!

Korean parents (many of whom are fairly rich) do throw money away on education simply because they think it's the thing to do. Some academies refuse to give kids grades of 'average' or below - how can everyone at an academy be above the average level there?

Some Koreans also seem to think there are two kinds of English teachers: a) Native Korean teacher who drills grammar and vocabulary into a kid who's forced to memorise heaps of things he immediately forgets; whether or not the Korean teacher can actually speak English is irrelevant. And b) Foreign teacher who is an English clown who sings and dances and acts out skits, somehow improving the Korean kids' conversational ability by edutaining them. Thankfully I have a job that's quite a happy median - I get to have lots of fun with my students but also get taken seriously and get to do real English teaching in a very orderly classroom. My salary is paid by my school board, and I don't have to worry one bit about catering to costumers.

That's the sort of job I had in mind re: Thailand - are there any such jobs in regular, academic schools where the foreign teacher is just one of the teachers?
« Last Edit: March 31, 2006, 12:10:25 pm by bcqcboy »

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #18 on: March 31, 2006, 12:19:25 pm »
You can refuse to work anywhere, your choice, but it sounds like you have very subjective criteria in which to evaluate schools, and I can't really figure out what you want. A school that pays teachers a lot of money but aren't interested in their own profits? Slim pickings anywhere I would suspect.

I would prefer to work at a school that *isn't* for proffit - you know, a regular middle or high school where presumably most Thais go for their secdonary education. Do none exist over there?

Let me guess, you're a language academy owner or supervisor who's fed up with foreign teachers who are either irresponsible substance-abusers or people who are responsible but so demanding that they actually think they're there to teach and quit when they figure out what a farce it is? If so, you should have coffee with a 'Yeonguk hogwan wongjongnim' from Korea - see if you can find one coming off the tour bus at the temple - I'm sure the two of you could really empathise.

Offline Notanewbie

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #19 on: March 31, 2006, 03:47:33 pm »
"you're a language academy owner or supervisor who's fed up with foreign teachers who are either irresponsible substance-abusers or people who are responsible but so demanding that they actually think they're there to teach and quit when they figure out what a farce it is?"

Nothing of the sort, just a sorry little teacher working at a non-profit but privately owned university teaching business related topics and economic, and an occasional ESL course. I also do some part-time teaching at a few government unis as well. (at times it sucks knowing a thing or two about economics, it makes it impossible to accept simplictic solutions to complex problems) I started out in the teaching profession (I consider myself a professional and not a clown) as a 220 baht an hour language school teacher. I have gained experience and additional qualifications since then and have worked in Thailand outside of teaching as well.?
Of course there are government schools here; they pay in general 18,000 baht plus housing allowance of around 8,000 baht a month with some places having options to work overtime. Fine for a recent graduate wanting to spend a year abroad before starting their real career or a retiree, but not very attractive for someone in their prime earning years.

I still don't understand your obsession with the profitability of places of employment. If you are an employees, you should only be concerned with your own compensation and working conditions, what others are making is irrelevant.

I "refuse" to work cleaning up dog doo-doo or in many other different situations. So what? If you refuse to work in Thailand or in any particular situation that?s up to you, but why do you feel the need to inform everyone where you "refuse" to work? (how can you refuse to do something no one ever asked you to do?)

Like I said, in my opinion Thailand is not for you and others with extremely judgmental-socialistic attitudes. Thais like to make money, the vast majority of adult English students are studying here to gain economic benefits and you wouldn't want to contribute to anyone studying in order to increase their income in the future either I suppose.

Enjoy your "top paying" perfect job, you won't find anything here to meet your needs. It must be interesting going through life living in Asia having an uncontrollable desire to pass judgement on every aspect of life whether one understands it or not.

Cheers
« Last Edit: March 31, 2006, 03:48:51 pm by Notanewbie »

Offline NukeThemSlowly

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #20 on: March 31, 2006, 08:07:56 pm »
This is sounding a lot like a certain Thai-TEFL troll that others here may have heard of...

Ok, Korea-boy-  tell us this.  What's your visa situation?  Last I heard, there weren't too many completely above-board jobs in Korea- still mainly cowboy country.  Tell us the name (and preferably the website) of the government scheme that allows you to teach in the public schools in the country.

Thread-stopper?  I think so.

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #21 on: April 03, 2006, 06:28:15 am »
This is sounding a lot like a certain Thai-TEFL troll that others here may have heard of...

Ok, Korea-boy-?tell us this.?What's your visa situation??Last I heard, there weren't too many completely above-board jobs in Korea- still mainly cowboy country.?Tell us the name (and preferably the website) of the government scheme that allows you to teach in the public schools in the country.

Thread-stopper??I think so.


Post deleted on advice of privacy considerations.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2006, 08:21:13 am by bcqcboy »

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #22 on: April 03, 2006, 07:38:10 am »
"you're a language academy owner or supervisor who's fed up with foreign teachers who are either irresponsible substance-abusers or people who are responsible but so demanding that they actually think they're there to teach and quit when they figure out what a farce it is?"

Nothing of the sort, just a sorry little teacher working at a non-profit but privately owned university teaching business related topics and economic, and an occasional ESL course. I also do some part-time teaching at a few government unis as well. (at times it sucks knowing a thing or two about economics, it makes it impossible to accept simplictic solutions to complex problems) I started out in the teaching profession (I consider myself a professional and not a clown) as a 220 baht an hour language school teacher. I have gained experience and additional qualifications since then and have worked in Thailand outside of teaching as well.?
Of course there are government schools here; they pay in general 18,000 baht plus housing allowance of around 8,000 baht a month with some places having options to work overtime. Fine for a recent graduate wanting to spend a year abroad before starting their real career or a retiree, but not very attractive for someone in their prime earning years.

I still don't understand your obsession with the profitability of places of employment. If you are an employees, you should only be concerned with your own compensation and working conditions, what others are making is irrelevant.

I "refuse" to work cleaning up dog doo-doo or in many other different situations. So what? If you refuse to work in Thailand or in any particular situation that?s up to you, but why do you feel the need to inform everyone where you "refuse" to work? (how can you refuse to do something no one ever asked you to do?)

Like I said, in my opinion Thailand is not for you and others with extremely judgmental-socialistic attitudes. Thais like to make money, the vast majority of adult English students are studying here to gain economic benefits and you wouldn't want to contribute to anyone studying in order to increase their income in the future either I suppose.

Enjoy your "top paying" perfect job, you won't find anything here to meet your needs. It must be interesting going through life living in Asia having an uncontrollable desire to pass judgement on every aspect of life whether one understands it or not.

Cheers


Well at least it's useful to know that. I also have a friend here in Korea who wants to marry a Laotian and is interested in opportunities in SE Asia. I'm glad you've been able to find a decent job in non-proffit education - that's the sort of thing I was interested in.

My dislike of private, for-proffit education comes manly from what I've observed here in Korea. Businesspeople whose only concerns are making money and saving face so often prey on parents desperate to do anything to give their kids an edge, creating a learning enviornment that is 90% just show. There are a few good private language academies run by competent people that try to build up a good reputation by offering good education, but they are, sadly, a small minority. I don't have a problem with people making a reasonable proffit from providing good, honest services (take for instance Yale Academy in Daegu - the owners must be swimming in cash and from what I've heard of the place deservedly so; they simply expel trouble-makers and ensure a high quality of education rather than trying to hold on to every last paying customer no matter what). I've read a bit about private academies in Thailand and it sounds very similar to what's par for the course in Korea, but with even less teaching resources in the former. Making money is fine; ripping people off isn't.

Sorry for being so curious as the result of a two-week holiday to your beautiful country.

Offline NukeThemSlowly

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #23 on: April 03, 2006, 07:49:56 pm »
Your curiosity seems less than sincere.  You already knew what your salary was in Thai baht, and that it was something you could brag about.  Of course, you fail to mention how the higher costs of living burn that salary up.

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #24 on: April 04, 2006, 08:38:49 am »
Your curiosity seems less than sincere.? You already knew what your salary was in Thai baht, and that it was something you could brag about.? Of course, you fail to mention how the higher costs of living burn that salary up.

Yes, I had just returned from Thailand where I was (trying to) convert Won to Baht all the time. The cost of living isn't terribly high in Korea and I get free housing, though winter uitility bills can be atrocious (they're not very good at insulating things).

I was just hoping that perhaps jobs (regardless of income) similar to mine existed in Thailand in the event I find I've had enough of Korea.

Offline bangjock

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #25 on: April 05, 2006, 10:45:14 am »
bcqcboy,

There are some very good jobs here in Thailand, but it normally takes a bit of time or some contacts to find them.

Granted there are some very poor Thai Government schools, but here I mean poor as in short of cash. Most Government schools are not particularly well funded and they must find ways to obtain additional funding, ie back handers for entering the school, setting up of special programs and so forth. As a general rule, they may not pay particulary well, but can be an excellent place to work due to the support you get from the Thai staff.

Other Thai Government schools are very well funded, and have excellent reputations, and as such pay very well. My own school falls into this category and pays better than nearly all of the private schools.

Private schools need to make money, just like government schools. Somchai, however, pays a lot more money to 'pass' in a private school.

 What makes a good school? Some schools are 'good' places to work by having reliable coworkers, supportive Thai teachers and admin, and maybe even a not-so-annoying school song. Small classes help.

Others are 'bad' places to work- bunch of idiotic, complaining, 'ex-plumber-met-a-Thai-bird-on-holiday' type coworkers, ridiculous hours and duties, nasty Thai staff and admin, and a three-day wait for photcopying. Lets not even get into money- read the forum.

There are so many variables.

If you want my view, give it a try. Save some of that Won your earning and you've always got a safety net. I've lived and worked in many places in SE Asia and Thailand takes some beating.

Bangjock.

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #26 on: April 05, 2006, 12:50:05 pm »
Thanks for the info, Bangjock.

Are you the only foreigner at your school? I am, and I rather like it that way as I get to set the bar myself and don't have to worry about foreign co-workers screwing things up and ruining it for everyone. How many students do you see in a week and how often do you get to see each class you teach? Do you have a set curriculum or do you make up your own? What grades do you teach?

I hear what you're saying about resources. Apart from a colour printer I have everything that I want, though when the classroom computer / monitor isn't working and I want to show something it's a real witch. Korea's very wired in more ways than one.

Like in Thailand, landing a good job in Korea can be difficult from outside the country, but isn't too difficult if one knows the place a bit and has time to do some research. I don't know if I could ever abondon my students but it's always nice to hear what the score is in other Asian countries when thinking long-term. Cheers.

Offline bangjock

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #27 on: April 05, 2006, 02:05:42 pm »
bcqcboy,

This year, we are a team of 5 foreign teachers, all very good with a wealth of experience between us? {-}. I was very lucky in that I was given the freedom (and carrots!) to pick my own team. Last year, I was not so fortunate, the initial agency supplied science teacher was an unreliable drunk? ?{-- , and his subsequent replacement, an obnoxious git? >:(. Apparently both had science degrees, but neither could teach.? ? ?

We run an English program with 2 classes in each grade M1-3, so a total of 6 classes, each of which we see 3 times a week.? ? The curriculum we follow is the Thai Basic Education curriculum. Initially it was a real drag, as finding English language texts for Science and Math that are close to the Thai curriculum is impossible. Hence a lot of material was created in-house. This year we have English language texts that follow the Thai curriculum, they are based on a Malaysian textbook series and are really quite good (and cheap).? ?

As far as other resources, we're really very lucky. We have more computers than students and lots of other e-learning stuff. The school do expect a lot in terms of unit outlines and lesson planning, and we have to deal with the dreaded pink? ป.พ.5. At the end of the day this is quite trivial and helps you do a better job. Where would the MOE be without paperwork?

There are good schools out there, you just have to be patient.

Oh yeah, at my last school I was the only foreign teacher and to be honest, I didn't like it much. Having lunch with the Thai staff everyday got a bit heavy, and I was everyone's lacky when it came to proof reading etc....

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #28 on: April 06, 2006, 08:14:39 am »
Bangjock,

That sounds like a really interesting job. I only teach most of my students once a week, so it's a lot more difficult to get to konw them. The advantage to this, however, is that my lesson is always something new and different, and I can recycle a lot of the same material and just adjust it to the level of the class.

Is English the primary language of instruction at your school? One thing I find really pathetic is how the Korean English teachers never use English as the language of instruction - I've stood outside an 'English' lesson for five minutes and only heard several phrases of English.

Are your students well sorted as to ability? By the time my students get to year three of high school (grade 12 / upper sixth form) I have some who are almost fluent and others who have long since given up on English.

I had to laugh about your comment on having lunch with the Thai staff. I usually eat both lunch and dinner at my school's cafeteria and sometimes I wait til the teachers have finished and go eat with the students.


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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #29 on: April 13, 2006, 08:14:27 pm »
It took me a while to get to this topic and to read thru it and, it's been a while since anyone posted on this topic. I want to post because I taught English in Korea for just less than 2 years, in the MOE progam, EPIK (English Program in Korea) and for the past 8 years I have been teaching English in Thailand, six of those years at a private bilingual school, which is one of the 16 schools the Chinese-Thai family of owners has created over the past 40 years. Further, I left Korea after having spent two weeks vacation time here in Thailand during the January school break in Korea. I taught in Korea some time ago: 1996-98, so I cannot necessarily speak to the present in Korea, altho I still have Korean friends in Korea in education with whom I email. It seems that not much has changed in education in Korea since my experience there.   
Mods-Rocker precisely sums up the situation at private schools here in Thailand. Young Somchai is the typical student at a private school in Thailand and his parents no doubt are the typical parents of such kids here in Thailand. However, a private school here limits class size to 35 or so students, whereas the "public" (government) schools in Korea and Thailand have 55 students crammed into a classroom. The Hokwans you refer to in Korea are much like the private schools in Thailand. For example, the private school where I taught reqired the foreign and Thai  teachers to buy our own wyteboard markers. (The school's owners liked to say they are "frugal," but they misspell the word, as the actual spelling of the word is "c-h-e-a-p."  Profits, profits, profits, period.
Further, as to government schools in Thailand, they generally are not the place to be. There's an excellent government school near me but it's the rare exception; it's wanted to hire a native speaker of English for several years but just can't get anywhere near the money required. The Thai teachers of English there are excellent, so that somewhat compensates for the school's inability to get money from the government to hire a native English speaker.
Korean learners are serious about their education. Thai learners would play and talk in class each minute of the school year and not ever have the thought ocurr to them that they might be missing something, ie, an education.
"Public" education in Korea goes thru Grade 12. In Thailand,  it's Grade 8 officially but it's more Grade 6. Thais in Thai society are literate and numerate, but only minimally. Koreans are much better educated but have a more difficult time learning English than do Thais, both student-aged students and adults. There is a real interest in Thailand in learning English, whereas in Korea, even tho the ROK Government has native speakers in the government schools, Koreans aren't much interested in studying or learning English. As you know, the structure of Korean grammar, ie, subject, object, verb, presents a mind-boggling problem to Koreans in learning English (subject-verb-object). Moreover, Korean students don't see the native teacher long enuf (once a week) to learn any English or to have any reason or motivation to try to remember last week's lesson. Never once in Korea did I find a taxi driver who knew a word of English, whereas here a number of taxi drivers can converse in English or know enuff English to have a broken conversation in English. The education system in Korea is professional, whereas in Thailand educators (and Thais in every other profession) don't know the word. Owners of private schools know the word but bury it in the backyard, never allowing it to see the light of day.   
Thai learners are fun, warm and lovable people but often madening to try to teach. Korean learners are learners, period. Korean society is far more and better organized than is Thai society, a situation which presents itself in the classrooms of each country, respectively.  Korea some years ago make the breakthru to becoming a developed country, whereas in Thailand, the wealthy and ruling elites don't want an educated or socio-economically developed population as that would mean the rich and powerful elites would have to share the wealth of the country with the population in general. A recent minister of education refered to the student-centered classroom as "buffalo learning," which in the US would be akin to using the word "turkey" in negatively describing sthg or someone.
Hence, while there are some good people at the MOE here and some good propriatary schools, it's a big gamble to leave a good position at a good school in a developed country to relocate to a place that, while it is a tropical paradise and has warm and wonderful people, nonetheless is also full of 3rd World (read:desperate for money) swindlers, cheats, liars, frauds and thieves....in education as in every institution of the society.  Still, this is my 8th consecutive year teaching and living in Thailand. If what I say about Thailand, Thai people and the fact that this is my 8th consecutive year in Thailand seem contradictory,  there's a good word that describes the situation: "paradox."   

Offline bcqcboy

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Re: Teaching at public / private high schools in Thailand?
« Reply #30 on: April 17, 2006, 07:53:12 am »
Thanks so much for your reply, NamTok. What you say about Korea sitll holds true, though I have had one (out of well over a hundred) taxi driver who could hold a conversation. I had several in Thailand even though I only took about five or six cabs.

I find Korean students, at least high school students, to be a bit more of a mixed bag than what you describe. Some are motivated, some are lazy, some really want to learn English, some have given up on English, some learn quickly, and some learn slowly. My class sizes are only around 30 so I have a much easier time of things.

All the same, it was very interesting to read your comparison.

 

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